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The Bad Side of Woo

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The Bad Side of Woo

Postby really? » 01 Apr 2010, 21:22

really?
 
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby NucleicAcid » 02 Apr 2010, 08:04

That's not really woo...that's religious oppression. The Lebanese man did not do anything wrong. Sure, you may not agree with his practices, but as far as I can tell, his 'woo' didn't harm anyone.

Harmful woo is like when the AIDS mother chooses not to take HAART in favor of orange juice and homeopathy, and she and her daughter die of opportunistic infections.
Hey, you there. Yes, you.

If what I say sounds like the teacher from Charlie Brown (Wah wahh woohh wuh waah), then you should try college. It's fun, and only costs you your soul and several tens of thousands of dollars. :)

“I agree that by the standards of any other area of science that remote viewing is proven“ - Richard Wiseman

Let's make directional hypotheses, test them repeatedly, replicate experiments, and publish results! Yay, science!
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby ciscop » 02 Apr 2010, 08:40

i am with really on this one
Religion is WOO

is woo on both sides
the lebanese idiot that believes he can do it for real
and the swetty camel riders that believe in mahoma and witchcraft
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby Nostradamus » 02 Apr 2010, 10:25

Scimitars were not available - beware January 19, 2038 is upon us.
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby really? » 02 Apr 2010, 12:19

Last edited by really? on 02 Apr 2010, 21:01, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby Nostradamus » 02 Apr 2010, 19:26

Scimitars were not available - beware January 19, 2038 is upon us.
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby NucleicAcid » 03 Apr 2010, 01:59

I'm fully aware of what Wiseman said.

I just selectively ignore it because he used "begs the question" incorrectly. :-P

Begging the question is the following train of logic:

Psi does not exist
The evidence for psi is not good enough, because psi does not exist, so the data must be full of errors
Psi has not been proven to exist because the evidence doesn't support it.
The data for psi must contain errors, because psi has not been proven to exist.
Repeat.

The important point of the matter is, the community of skeptics simultaneously argue that 1) There is next to zero evidence for psi, and there is no way it exists 2) There is enough evidence to show that psi exists by any other measure of science, but there needs to be much more evidence before we will consider its existence seriously, because it would revolutionize the world of science.

The skeptical community needs to make up its damn mind. Either renounce the possibility of psi wholesale, or agree that it is plausible, as long as there continues to be evidenced produced for it.
Hey, you there. Yes, you.

If what I say sounds like the teacher from Charlie Brown (Wah wahh woohh wuh waah), then you should try college. It's fun, and only costs you your soul and several tens of thousands of dollars. :)

“I agree that by the standards of any other area of science that remote viewing is proven“ - Richard Wiseman

Let's make directional hypotheses, test them repeatedly, replicate experiments, and publish results! Yay, science!
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Joined: 26 Mar 2010, 04:20

Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby really? » 03 Apr 2010, 03:29

really?
 
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby ciscop » 03 Apr 2010, 04:42

oooh really
common

he cant do that
otherwise the paranormal wouldnt be paranormal

there is nothing there but the imagination
and for me that's good enought
i love the lenght of the human imagination
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby really? » 03 Apr 2010, 09:18

really?
 
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby NucleicAcid » 03 Apr 2010, 23:03

Hey, you there. Yes, you.

If what I say sounds like the teacher from Charlie Brown (Wah wahh woohh wuh waah), then you should try college. It's fun, and only costs you your soul and several tens of thousands of dollars. :)

“I agree that by the standards of any other area of science that remote viewing is proven“ - Richard Wiseman

Let's make directional hypotheses, test them repeatedly, replicate experiments, and publish results! Yay, science!
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Posts: 169
Joined: 26 Mar 2010, 04:20

Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby Nostradamus » 03 Apr 2010, 23:06

Scimitars were not available - beware January 19, 2038 is upon us.
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby NucleicAcid » 03 Apr 2010, 23:13

That would be tricky to fit in a single post. You're invoking about a century of research, experiments, journal articles, conventions, commentary, arguments, and discussions.

However, someone has already summed up the very best of it into one convenient, 300 page package:

Image



It's a wonderful read. It reads like a newspaper but it's annotated like a textbook.
Hey, you there. Yes, you.

If what I say sounds like the teacher from Charlie Brown (Wah wahh woohh wuh waah), then you should try college. It's fun, and only costs you your soul and several tens of thousands of dollars. :)

“I agree that by the standards of any other area of science that remote viewing is proven“ - Richard Wiseman

Let's make directional hypotheses, test them repeatedly, replicate experiments, and publish results! Yay, science!
User avatar
NucleicAcid
 
Posts: 169
Joined: 26 Mar 2010, 04:20

Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby Nostradamus » 03 Apr 2010, 23:23

So there isn't an instance where there is an experiment you can point to that demonstrates success such as in the case of the AIDS work you pointed to in another thread?

When you go back a century you end up including the work at Duke that has not been replicated.
Scimitars were not available - beware January 19, 2038 is upon us.
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Re: The Bad Side of Woo

Postby NucleicAcid » 03 Apr 2010, 23:30

Science only very rarely does a "single experiment" to prove something, and usually that's only when they already know the answer, they just want to feel cocky because they are scientists, and that's what we like doing. Like the recent experiment that showed frame dragging due to Earth's rotation. But even then, that isn't the single experiment that has verified special relativity.

But nonetheless I can still deliver.

If you want a SINGLE experiment, with the most number of participants (several million), that would probably be the Got Psi report



That's the preliminary. I can't get my hands on the full report because JSE has been remodeling their website. But it shows a very significant overall effect nonetheless.

I should also note for the AIDS thing, that that case didn't PROVE HIV or AIDS. It's just a demonstration of what we would expect to see if it did exist, which it does, but that was determined through many other means. In fact, HIV, like most cutting edge discoveries, raised a HUGE stink in the world of science when it first came onto the scene. Science ALWAYS pisses and moans over validity whenever something new or unknown is discovered. Then, once all of that blows over, you'd be an idiot to question the generally accepted hypothesis.

Plate techtonics, quantum mechanics, endosymbiotic theory, yada yada yada.
Hey, you there. Yes, you.

If what I say sounds like the teacher from Charlie Brown (Wah wahh woohh wuh waah), then you should try college. It's fun, and only costs you your soul and several tens of thousands of dollars. :)

“I agree that by the standards of any other area of science that remote viewing is proven“ - Richard Wiseman

Let's make directional hypotheses, test them repeatedly, replicate experiments, and publish results! Yay, science!
User avatar
NucleicAcid
 
Posts: 169
Joined: 26 Mar 2010, 04:20

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