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Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Discussions about the James Randi Educational Foundation and its Million Dollar Challenge.

Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby highflyertoo » 19 Aug 2009, 17:35

The Warrigal wrote:Hi Highflyer.

With respect. - I think that you are flogging one very dead horse here.

Several people have tried to explain to you that the much vaunted lie detector doesn't work as advertised and can easily be defeated.

I am interested in your stated ability to perform TK, however, but if you can do as you say then please show us don't tell us.


Let loud mouth Randi take the LDT Test to prove that he's at least being complient in trying to further consiladate his word.
Randi was no researcher of the paranormal even though he tried half heartedly.... Shows over.
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby ProfWag » 19 Aug 2009, 21:42

Is this website a forum to trash Randi and the JREF or is this a serious forum that seeks clarification concerning skeptical analysis as is the title of the website? There are so many more posts towards the million dollar challenge than there are serious discussions on the paranormal that it's ridiculous.
I just don't understand it.
Bottom line, if someone wants to think there is fraud in the JREF, then fine. Grab you a lawyer and go prove it or quite worrying about it. Otherwise, if you're not satisfied with his rules, then apply to show your paranormal abilities in one of the other dozen or so paranormal challenges that are out there. Don't worry about the money. If you win one of those other prizes, you'll become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams.
Now, how about some serious discussion on UFOs, psychics, or anything else that's really cool and a heck of a lot more fun to talk about.
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby brett » 19 Aug 2009, 22:48

ProfWag wrote:Is this website a forum to trash Randi and the JREF or is this a serious forum that seeks clarification concerning skeptical analysis as is the title of the website? There are so many more posts towards the million dollar challenge than there are serious discussions on the paranormal that it's ridiculous.
I just don't understand it.
Bottom line, if someone wants to think there is fraud in the JREF, then fine. Grab you a lawyer and go prove it or quite worrying about it. Otherwise, if you're not satisfied with his rules, then apply to show your paranormal abilities in one of the other dozen or so paranormal challenges that are out there. Don't worry about the money. If you win one of those other prizes, you'll become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams.
Now, how about some serious discussion on UFOs, psychics, or anything else that's really cool and a heck of a lot more fun to talk about.


well said sir !! :D
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby NinjaPuppy » 19 Aug 2009, 23:03

Ditto what Brett said!
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby ciscop » 20 Aug 2009, 00:21

Ditto
what ninjapuppy said
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby General Zod » 20 Aug 2009, 00:26

brett wrote:general zod opined : " but it doesn't change that Randi doesn't have to prove anything to you- any more than you have to prove anything to him."

so if your last comment is correct then whats the point in anyone taking the challenge in the first place ?? why should they bother IF ,as you opine "they don't have to prove anything to him " seems like a self defeating argument to me :?


What I meant by my comment is that proving your claims is not about Randi. If you have paranormal abilities, it doesn't make any sense to me at all that you wouldn't just prove it rather than attacking Randi and the MDC. Your purported abilities would be much bigger than anything Randi represents.

Look again at what ProfWag said. If you don't like Randi's challenge, don't participate. If you think it's fraudulent, then prove it. If you can move statues with your mind, then you needn't prove it to Randi. Call your local newspaper or TV station. When you're world famous for your paranormal abilities and we must rewrite all of our science books, it will be impossible for Randi to ignore you.

If you would still prefer to drug and interrogate an old man than demonstrate your own abilities, then I really don't know what else to say.
Last edited by General Zod on 20 Aug 2009, 03:37, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby Shadowcat » 20 Aug 2009, 01:12

I may be new here, but having read this thread from start to finish it seems that it has become pointless and destructive, the horse died a few pages ago guys.
There are far more interesting subjects than this to discuss. Only Randi knows what he is or isnt willing to do so it really is a moot point to speculate on.

If someone thinks that they can beat the challenge they are free to try, and just as free not to if they dont like it, just as everyone, and i mean everyone, is entitled to their own opinions and the right to voice those opinions.

Profwag,Brett,Ninja Puppy,Ciscop, add my ditto to yours

Now...*rubs hands* lets get into some more substantial discussions :D
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby highflyertoo » 20 Aug 2009, 08:17

ProfWag wrote:Is this website a forum to trash Randi and the JREF or is this a serious forum that seeks clarification concerning skeptical analysis as is the title of the website? There are so many more posts towards the million dollar challenge than there are serious discussions on the paranormal that it's ridiculous.
I just don't understand it.
Bottom line, if someone wants to think there is fraud in the JREF, then fine. Grab you a lawyer and go prove it or quite worrying about it. Otherwise, if you're not satisfied with his rules, then apply to show your paranormal abilities in one of the other dozen or so paranormal challenges that are out there. Don't worry about the money. If you win one of those other prizes, you'll become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams.
Now, how about some serious discussion on UFOs, psychics, or anything else that's really cool and a heck of a lot more fun to talk about.


For applicants who have real power the MDC Rules are crooked.

Why wait until March 2010 to straighten the rules. Straighten them now.

And as for you bogus skeptics, how dare you say how straight Randi is when his Challenge has more holes in it than a Donut Bakery

If you don't like some people having BALLS to confront Randi's Challenge, then I suggest you admire someone else who can be trusted. Randi's reputation was built on conning people, So he is hardly the right man for debunking lies.

What is required are upright men and women, even upright children with good hearts.

The JREF league members are ''scoffers'', Ive watched videos were the audience atomatically laughs in response to Randi's laughter.

Here's some advice, critically think for yourselves and critically laugh for yourselves ;)
Randi was no researcher of the paranormal even though he tried half heartedly.... Shows over.
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby highflyertoo » 20 Aug 2009, 08:21

Will you Randi take the LDT Challenge ? The clock counter has begun.
Randi was no researcher of the paranormal even though he tried half heartedly.... Shows over.
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby ProfWag » 20 Aug 2009, 08:49

highflyertoo wrote:
ProfWag wrote:Is this website a forum to trash Randi and the JREF or is this a serious forum that seeks clarification concerning skeptical analysis as is the title of the website? There are so many more posts towards the million dollar challenge than there are serious discussions on the paranormal that it's ridiculous.
I just don't understand it.
Bottom line, if someone wants to think there is fraud in the JREF, then fine. Grab you a lawyer and go prove it or quite worrying about it. Otherwise, if you're not satisfied with his rules, then apply to show your paranormal abilities in one of the other dozen or so paranormal challenges that are out there. Don't worry about the money. If you win one of those other prizes, you'll become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams.
Now, how about some serious discussion on UFOs, psychics, or anything else that's really cool and a heck of a lot more fun to talk about.


For applicants who have real power the MDC Rules are crooked.

Why wait until March 2010 to straighten the rules. Straighten them now.

And as for you bogus skeptics, how dare you say how straight Randi is when his Challenge has more holes in it than a Donut Bakery

If you don't like some people having BALLS to confront Randi's Challenge, then I suggest you admire someone else who can be trusted. Randi's reputation was built on conning people, So he is hardly the right man for debunking lies.

What is required are upright men and women, even upright children with good hearts.

The JREF league members are ''scoffers'', Ive watched videos were the audience atomatically laughs in response to Randi's laughter.

Here's some advice, critically think for yourselves and critically laugh for yourselves ;)

Please refer me to where I commented on how straight his challenge is. Also, refer me to where I said I admired him. I agree with much of what he has to say, but not everything.
All I said is that if you (or Dave) or anyone else doesn’t like his rules, go somewhere else. There are other choices, especially if you "critically think for yourselves.". That’s the beauty of living in free countries, you have a choice to go somewhere else. If I go to my Doctor and don’t like or agree with what I’m told, I simply go somewhere else. Why don’t you? I can assure you that Randi’s feelings won’t be hurt in the least.
C’mon, if you have a paranormal power, the world is waiting!
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby Mistislav D'ralle » 20 Aug 2009, 09:16

JonDonnis wrote:Dont you think very highly paid lawyers havent looked at the rules?


Only a party to a contract offering performance can make an application to enforce performance of the other party due to privity laws or contract review acts. You have to enter it to make an application against the contract. Alternatively, a application under consumer protection laws requires there to be misleading or deceptive conduct about a service or product but no service or product is being supplied. The same laws used by JREF are used by fundamentalist challenges.

As we say about boats in Murmank "Yuri...it's Iron clad, take wood drill back to workshop, holes won't become reality"
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby General Zod » 20 Aug 2009, 11:00

highflyertoo wrote:
ProfWag wrote:Is this website a forum to trash Randi and the JREF or is this a serious forum that seeks clarification concerning skeptical analysis as is the title of the website? There are so many more posts towards the million dollar challenge than there are serious discussions on the paranormal that it's ridiculous.
I just don't understand it.
Bottom line, if someone wants to think there is fraud in the JREF, then fine. Grab you a lawyer and go prove it or quite worrying about it. Otherwise, if you're not satisfied with his rules, then apply to show your paranormal abilities in one of the other dozen or so paranormal challenges that are out there. Don't worry about the money. If you win one of those other prizes, you'll become wealthy beyond your wildest dreams.
Now, how about some serious discussion on UFOs, psychics, or anything else that's really cool and a heck of a lot more fun to talk about.


For applicants who have real power the MDC Rules are crooked.

Why wait until March 2010 to straighten the rules. Straighten them now.

And as for you bogus skeptics, how dare you say how straight Randi is when his Challenge has more holes in it than a Donut Bakery

If you don't like some people having BALLS to confront Randi's Challenge, then I suggest you admire someone else who can be trusted. Randi's reputation was built on conning people, So he is hardly the right man for debunking lies.

What is required are upright men and women, even upright children with good hearts.

The JREF league members are ''scoffers'', Ive watched videos were the audience atomatically laughs in response to Randi's laughter.

Here's some advice, critically think for yourselves and critically laugh for yourselves ;)


Balls? :lol:

You don't even need tiny little balls to make cracks at the MDC anonymously over the internet. It's not like Randi will do anything about it, even if he could.

All of us, except for you apparently, seem to agree that Randi's not all that important in the greater scheme of things. It's not exactly the position one of his uncritical followers would take.

How exactly are you confronting the MDC, other than posting on this forum?
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby highflyertoo » 20 Aug 2009, 12:11

To opposers of general skepticism.

This site allows people to discuss Randi's MDC without being told how to think.

The Professor was banned off JREF for what? was the Professor hitting a ''raw nerve'' with Jeff Wagg ?

At least on this site here, One can be Skeptical in the more open unhinderd true sensible manner, which is greatly lacking on other sites that refer to themselves as being seekers of the truth.
Randi was no researcher of the paranormal even though he tried half heartedly.... Shows over.
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby brett » 20 Aug 2009, 12:32

general zod opined :"If you would still prefer to drug and interrogate an old man than demonstrate your own abilities, then I really don't know what else to say. "

oh i have no wish to drug and interrogate an old man - he is not THAT important in the scheme of things anyway - and i don't claim to have ANY paranormal powers - so the test is irrelevant to me - what i just don't understand is WHY this whole issue is soooooooooooo important ( seemingly ) to so many people ??

it seems to have obtained the status of an "obsession" with some here - surly there are more important and wider issues at hand ?? :?
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Re: Would Randi take a Lie Detector Test?

Postby highflyertoo » 20 Aug 2009, 16:20

If Randi wants someone to win the prize then he can pass the money over to an independent group of Scienctists and let them carry out experiments within a designated TIME FRAME , or Randi can keep running his competition providing he sits the LDT.

Does Randi want real magic or poop magic ?.
Randi was no researcher of the paranormal even though he tried half heartedly.... Shows over.
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