Discuss Conspiracies and Cover Ups - e.g. 9/11 Truth, JFK Assassination, New World Order, Roswell, Moon Hoax, Secret Societies, etc. whatever conspiracy floats your boat.
16 Oct 2009, 21:37
Your counter-arguments, claims, and mis-informative videos are exhausting Scepcop. Those of us who think your conspiracy theory is a crock o’ crap have shown you time and time again that the arguments he (and others) has presented do not stand up to scrutiny. None of them, actually. My take on Gage is that he may well in fact feel there were controlled demolitions. He may firmly believe it! He may actually be totally sincere in his character (I’m not convinced and also believe he is a fraud or at best, willing to present invalid information, but I’m not arguing that point here.) The evidence remains that his points do not stand up to proper investigative research or even common sense.
I provided the following link in another thread that shows how science has proven that the buildings did not fall via the result of a controlled demolition: However, you completely ignored it and did not respond. Why? It’s because it’s proof that Gage’s information does not stand up to review. Instead, you want to claim a silly flow chart is “scientific.” Again, here’s the link that I would like for you to read. I already know you won’t because it doesn’t mesh with your ideas. http://wtc7lies.googlepages.com/Bazant_ ... Did_No.pdf
16 Oct 2009, 21:53
Here's some more information on the accuracy of Mr. Gage:
"–Gage repeatedly claims that “They would bring up these multi-ton chunks of this previously molten substance, which turns out to be iron.” This is simply a lie. Gage can name no Ground Zero worker who claims this. Nor can Gage show where any formerly molten material was tested to determine its composition. I spoke with Dave Peraza, the engineer in charge of all Ground Zero cleanup: "I never saw pools or lakes of molten, or previously molten, steel. Neither in the subgrade levels, nor as material that was loaded onto trucks by the grapplers and cranes."
Yet more Richard Gage lies: experts agree with him?
One of the most reprehensible things this scumbag Gage does in his PowerPoint presentation is lie about legitimate, reknowned professionals supporting his claims. Here are some of the people he cites in a section called "Experts Agree."
Gage repeatedly cites Mike Taylor, the head of the National Demolition Association, in support of his claims. Here’s what Mike Taylor told me when I asked him about that: “The fall of the structures occurred because of a variety of circumstances ALL related to the crashing of the two airplanes into them. Numerous studies have been conducted by various governmental and independent entities to back this claim."
Gage cites fire scientist James Quintiere as being critical of the NIST report. He fails to cite Dr. Quintiere's conclusion, which is that towers likely would have collapsed from the fires alone, even without the structural and fireproofing damage caused by airliners hitting them.
Gage cites reknowned structural engineer Matthys Levy, who worked independently on the collapse investigations as saying, "It looks like a managed demolition.” Here’s what Levy actually says: "SOME people might thinks this: it LOOKS like a controlled demolition. But it has NOTHING to do with it."
In his slide show Gage says about structural engineer Ronald Hamburger, “Even FEMA's Structural Engineer Questions the Collapses.” Perhaps Gage should have attended Ronald Hamburger’s ANTI-conspiracy talk about the collapse of the WTC buildings at the Center for Inquiry in San Francisco.
Gage cites explosives expert Van Romero in support of his claims. Here’s what Romero says: "Certainly the fire is what caused the building to fail."
Gage takes Dutch demolitions contractor Danny Jowenko’s word as authoritative that building 7 was brought down by explosives. I assume that Gage ALSO takes Jowenko's word as authoritative that the Twin Towers were NOT brought down by explosives.
16 Oct 2009, 21:55
And even more false representations or complete nonsense. Gage's website puts out so much junk he can't keep them straight any more:
Here's what Gage's "expert" structural engineers say. All quotes are from Gage's website. These are the words of his best and brightest.
–Charles Pegelow thinks nuclear weapons destroyed the towers. No, I'm not kidding.
–Robert T. Mote thinks the tower collapses started from the bottom: "I could never understand the 'convenient' vertical collapse at the BASE due to an extreme event at height."
–Structural engineer Dennis Kollar says, “For me the most convincing aspect that the 911 collapse was a controlled demolition is the recorded explosions on the 9/11 Eyewitness DVD.” The "recorded explosions" he's referring to are wind noise captured by the camera in Hoboken, a few miles away from the WTC. That should be staggeringly obvious to anyone who has seen footage from close to the WTC, where what would be absolutely enormous "explosions" are not captured by any microphones.
–Structural engineer Michael Donley says, "I have read the FEMA report and conclude that it is incomplete at best and a cover-up at worst.” The FEMA report? Welcome to 2002, Mr. Donley. You might try reading the 10,000 page NIST report. Can't blame you, though. Richard has led by example and not bothered to read the NIST report either. (Yes, I can prove that.)
–Engineer Edward Knesl says, “We do not know the phenomenon of the high rise building to disintegrate internally faster than the free fall of the debris coming down from the top.” Faster than freefall! He' hasn't even bothered to review videos of the collapses.
Can these people possibly be any less competent?
Actually, yes. Here's what AE 911 Truth engineer Donald Messerlian believes: “Seismographic evidence proved pre-planted explosives destroyed WTC 1, 2 and building 7 before the planes struck buildings 1 & 2.”
Right. The three WTC buildings were destroyed before the planes hit. In the same vein of disturbed fantasy, Richard's aerospace engineer is a "no-planer":
–"After performing some in-depth research on this subject, I have come to the conclusion that no commercial airplanes impacted the two WTC Towers. No commercial plane impacted the Pentagon. No commercial aircraft buried itself in Pennsylvania terra firma."
16 Oct 2009, 22:38
Here is a you tube video pointing out 3 falsehoods from Mr. Gage. I won't go so far to say they are lies as the person on the film, but I will say they are either lies or he just never did research. There are many more which I will continue to post as these ridiculous conspiracy theories continue to get pushed through on this "paranormal" website. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10YTDOdyju0&feature=fvw
16 Oct 2009, 23:42
Excellent posts ProfWag. I love reading the nukes claim every time I read it.
There is a HardFire show in which a no-planer tries to show that all of the videos were faked and that no planes hit the buildings. This is just weird.
Here's the link. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... lDA&hl=en#
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