SCEPCOP Forum

Very interesting information indeed, August. I'll absorb and come up with more questions.

Okay, Craig, thanks for that. Feel free to ask me anything about my experiences. And, as far as investigators and researchers go, I have had the best there is investigate our family's encounters, and he determined our case was "very important".

Personally, I won't say that a person is "dilluted" if they think they have been abducted. It's a quite serious matter and many people are absolutely convinced of their experience.
I do find the subject quite fascinating--whether I think ET was actually involved or not. We (or "they" as Craig put us), should never just pass off testimony as unfounded and those that do are "pseudo-skeptics" in my opinion. Could there be a more "earthly" explanation? Absolutely. but that doesn't mean that the person who had the encounter is wrong or lying about what happened. We need to investigate these cases thoroughly which is why I began asking questions.

You guys are funny, you talk about the need to investigate, and I'm right here giving you the opportunity to investigate, but you don't. I have learned a great deal about the nature of these alien beings, their actions, their abilities, their ships, and I believe I can even shed some light on their intentions and their agenda. This information did not come easy, these ordeals were difficult to deal with, both at the time, and ever since. And all you have to do is ask. But you'd rather prattle about phony seances. You have displayed a stunning lack of intellectual curiosity, at least the jerks in the skeptics forums pressed for details and focused on finding gaffes or inconsistencies in my encounters, they followed up with the newspaper and television accounts of my encounters, they sought out the transcript of when Budd Hopkins discussed my case on Larry King live on CNN. You guys seem content to tell each other your views over and over again. The fact you both chose dogs for your avatars suddenly make more sense to me.

I'm starting to get a sense of why you weren't very popular on the other sites!

I tend to not get too involved with personal annecdotes of fellow forum members because it inevitably leads to hurt feelings if the person isn't immediately believed. That's why I prefer to discuss the scientific studies, which while I don't have a scientific background can at least usually be discussed objectively by all parties.

But I'll break my rule and ask you: how are we to tell the difference between your story being a well written fictional account vs. a true account? How are we to tell over the internet if your interpretation of your experiences is correct?

Now, I'm not calling you a liar or deluded. I'm asking what manner would we have to tell, over an internet forum?

That's the problem when dealing with the personal stories: how are they to be verified? Frankly, the question is: why should we believe you.

Please try to avoid being offended by these questions: forget about it being you: pretend I'm just talking about someone else with a similar story. I believe in skepticism: which means witholding belief absent reliable evidence. One anonymous person's story over the internet just isn't that reliable - EVEN IF TRUE. We have no way of evaluating your story.

But what I would suggest, if you're interested in getting a discussion going, is linking to the previous threads, so members can at least read what ground has already been covered.

First, my account is first-hand eye-witness testimonial evidence, to couch it in terms of personal "anecdotes" is a cliche intended to minimize my tesimony. Eyewitness testimony is the cornerstone of our system of justice. People are sentenced to death based solely on eyewitness testimony.

Nothing to be learned from an actual participant in alien contact of the fourth-kind? Nope, you prefer to discuss the "scientific studies". What scientific studies of first-hand alien contact are you talking about, specifically? Any in the last couple of years? 5 years? A decade? I must have missed those.

Then you ask me repeatedly how you can tell if what I say is true. You ask; "how are we to tell the difference?" "How are we to tell over the internet?" "What manner would we have to tell?" "Is your interpretation correct?" "How are they to be verified?" and finally, "Why should we believe you?"

Well, I had to think long and hard about how to answer these questions. Basically, you have to realize, this is your problem, not mine. The reality of my family's experiences are not affected either way. I suggest you use the God-given ability to reason that most of us are born with, Arouet, and make up your own mind. I'm sure when Paul Revere rode through Boston, some people didn't believe him that the British were coming. But it wasn't Paul Revere's responsibility to convince everyone that it was true. Nor is it mine. Although it's a bit grandiose to compare myself to Paul Revere, the alien situation is a hell of a lot more important than that british invasion was.

Craig, you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. You try and tell me that 'legit' abductees only talk about their experiences in therapy of with family? Nonsense, where's the facts that back up that nugget of wisdom? They never engage in debates? That we are all "uncertain"? More nonsense. What research led you to that conclusion? You're talking out your other orifice.

All abductees are worried they are "loosing" their marbles? First, it's spelled 'losing', as any fourth-grader will inform you. Your frequent miss-spelling lead me to draw conclusions about your intelligence. Second, this is again untrue. I'd like to know how many abductees you spoke with before coming to this conclusion? You say there have "been a few exceptions to this pattern, but not many". Oh really? Show me that study that revealed this "pattern", what research was this? Or is it simply the uninformed opinion of a guy who has trouble with rudimentary spelling.

Then you tell me the "hole in my story" is that it involves my whole family. This establishes you as completely uninformed. And as far as investigators, the most established, respected and important alien abduction expert in the world investigated our case quite thoroughly, thank you very much.

You want to meet an alien? Trust me, nothing would make me happier than you being abducted by aliens too. Then you could know what it feels like to talk to people who still manage to deny reality. You have seventy years of evidence of aliens in the modern era, if you've done more that a cursory examination, the evidence is overwhelming. Anyone still on the fence, undecided has only themselves to blame. Denial on that scale is inexcusable.

Sorry August, but I have to agree with Craig and Arouet. You've come to this forum with the title that you've been viciously attacked in two skeptic forums. However, after re-reading what Craig wrote and what you wrote, it appears that the opposite is true in this forum. Craig was not "viciously" attacking you and your response certainly was not warranted by his post. In my opinion, we've all been quite mature with you and your posts.
It is true that I am not in your shoes and I could only guess that I, too, would be quite defensive if I was convinced my story was factual and was questioned by others. However, from an outsider's point of view, your story IS quite sensational and although there is some evidence that abductions are factual (presented primarily from Hopkins and Mack among others), there is also significant evidence to suggest there is a more "earthly" explanation for abductions.
Again, as we've tried to point out to you, it is virtually impossible to do any kind of research in your story--especially if significant time is spent worrying about how another person on the forum spells something.