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Locked Sagan Thread

Discuss PseudoSkeptics and their Fallacies. Share strategies for debating them.

Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby ciscop » 12 Mar 2010, 00:33

is this thread is something along the lines of
¨skeptics attacked uri, so i will attack carl sagan?¨

if that´s it.. im all for it
carl sagan was never my cup of tea
:-D
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 01:05

It's news to me. The only source of this information appears to be Ann Duryan herself.

I don't see how the aliens will ever decrypt Ann's brainwaves. Carl Sagan forgot to include a phrenology map of Ann's skull.


You said:
It's no wonder why they kept the information about the brainwaves a secret for so long.

Now you admit that you posted a mistake. This is not true. Nothing was kept secret.

So instead of admitting this is a personal opinion, because much of what you posted has been shown to be incorrect, you switch to mocking. I'm not surprised.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 13:11

Nostradamus wrote:Again Kevin you point to a bad example in an effort to demonstrate that you are a pseudoskeptic relying on the fallacy of incredulity. Actually, this example is an irrelevant example verging on misrepresentation of the issue at hand.

First, let's make it clear that the hum is not due to the motor as you claim. It is a hum due to the compressor. Secondly, the hum of the compressor is not related to the food contents of the refrigerator. The hum is related to the controls inside of the refrigerator.

The only one you are fooling by these bad examples is yourself. I have already shown that thoughts can be extracted from brain waves. It has been done. End of story.

You might want to look over the following website to avoid the logical fallacies in your arguments:
http://www.logicalfallacies.info
Take a look at least at these issues, but don't stop there:
1. weak relevance
2. red herring
3. strawman fallacy
4. argument from ignorance






Nostradamus, your constant use of logical fallicy debate points is off-topic, irrelevent, boring, spammy .. illogical and fallacious. You sound like a broken record ..
.. a broken record
.. a broken record
.. a broke ..


Oh look .. is this a bum asking people for dollars and cents .. or is it a skeptic asking people for evidence and sense?

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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 13:19

Nostradamus, your constant use of logical fallicy[sic] debate points is off-topic, irrelevent[sic], boring, spammy .. illogical and fallacious. You sound like a broken record ..
.. a broken record
.. a broken record
.. a broke ..


Kevin you have posted no evidence for your claims.
1. Your claim of secrecy is wrong
2. Your refrigerator comparison is wrong
3. Your thought claim is wrong - look at the new items I posted at http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=996

The only one posting fallacies in this thread is Kevin Kane. It is long overdue for you to simply admit that your claims are all hogwash.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 13:28

The topic is Carl Sagan. Thanks for playing, spambot.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 13:42

In the "Should skeptics be certified" thread you post a lot of suggestions that you should consider yourself. You point fingers and make lots of unsubstantiated and often contradictory claims as you have done here. These are all things you said. You tell other people what they should do. How about taking your own advice, which you seem so free to dish out.

Could you "pass a test of scientific aptitude to show" you "understand the scientific method and have a good working knowledge of science? "

You should avoid doing what you claim other do
The practice of defamation of character is another unethical practice that skeptics engage in.


Here is another of your suggestions that you did not heed with your claim on thoughts.
One thing that annoys me is how skeptics can despute[sic] or 'debunk' something (homeopathy, Esp, ghosts, etc) without even trying it, or having experienced it, or even spending much time researching and considering it

It would have been easy for you look up information to learn that all sorts of groups are analyzing brain waves and other biological responses.

I take this to be another 4 letter word from that thread. Here you say that if you don't know what you are saying then maybe stopping is a good idea. That's a paraphrase without the F-bomb.
And I don't mean; speculate or pose half-assed maybe theories for the paranormal, but real science and logic. And if you can't prove it, STFU.


Another claim that you might want to consider.
Skepticism is just a way of controverting, disputing, debating, arguing, opposing, or just tossing monkey scat.

I'd suggest adding weaseling to the list.

There's a ton more advice of yours listed in that thread. Check it out.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 13:54

You seem to think this thread is about me. How did you arrive at such a conclusion?
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 14:04

The topic is Carl Sagan. Thanks for playing, spambot.

Actually no. The topic is why you are unable to accept that you and no else caused the Carl Sagan thread to be locked.

Then I asked about 1 of the claims you made in the thread that was locked. You failed to support this claim:
The chances of deciphering Ann Duryan's brainwave recordings: Big Zero.

It is very clear now that this claim was wrong as were a number of other claims you made in this thread.

Instead of saying something like you learned something new or whatever, you've drifted back to your old tactics of ad hominem attacks (see bolding above), mocking (http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=989&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=40#p11237), and snide comments (http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=989&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=40#p11270).

Did you learn something about brainwaves and the science of thought extraction from brain signals?
Are you going to follow your own advice - the restrictions you want to force onto others?
Or are you going to degrade this thread and force it to be locked, too.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 14:14

Yes, I learned that brainwaves can perform 'tricks' if properly trained and using the right detection equipment and reference database set. An elementary and highly dependant type of "mind reading", or imitation mind reading would be a better description. But if you wish to believe that science will one day be able to decrypt memories, feel free to do so. In the real world, we call this fantasy.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 14:22

You have yet to answer my question. You have also ignored previous requests for information in earlier posts. Am I to assume I'm talking to a machine .. Yes or No?
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 17:41

I'm almost sure this is the E.T. that Carl Sagan was thinking about when he was designing the golden record.

Cosmic Space Unicorn will find Voyager - it will read Ann Druyan's mindwaves .. it understands all.

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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 21:11

[quote]Yes, I learned that brainwaves can perform 'tricks' if properly trained and using the right detection equipment and reference database set. An elementary and highly dependant[sic] type of "mind reading", or imitation mind reading would be a better description. But if you wish to believe that science will one day be able to decrypt memories, feel free to do so. In the real world, we call this fantasy.[quote]

You are pretending to be willfully ignorant. That's sad. Brainwaves do not perform tricks. Brainwaves are measurements. Again you offer no proof of the need for a reference. Again in utter failure you resort to misrepresentation. That's tedious.

In the next post your dismal efforts at mockery are also sad.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 21:16

You have yet to answer my question. You have also ignored previous requests for information in earlier posts.

Please repost if you are actually interested. Due to your intransigent nature, plus your mockery, misrepresentation, and tendency to 4 letter words it is natural to skip over some of your posts.
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Nostradamus » 12 Mar 2010, 21:18

You seem to think this thread is about me. How did you arrive at such a conclusion?

How did you arrive at that mistaken conclusion?
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Re: Locked Sagan Thread

Postby Kevin Kane » 12 Mar 2010, 21:47

Nostradamus wrote: Brainwaves do not perform tricks. Brainwaves are measurements. Again you offer no proof of the need for a reference. Again in utter failure you resort to misrepresentation. That's tedious.


Do you know what this word means: Cloud

Without a reference in memory .. the word is meaningless.

Do you know what the word 'reference' means?
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