Discuss PseudoSkeptics and their Fallacies. Share strategies for debating them.
Clinton's people had targets UBL and were close to actually taking him out on a couple of occasions ... I wish I could remember where I saw it... I think it was 60 Minutes that had footage from a drone showing Obama in their sites but for some reason the mission was called off and the lost their advantage (and this was a good year before 9/11 I believe). But aside from that as the torch was being passed members of Clinton's own security & intelligence teams had brief W and the other thing that few folks realize is that sitting president's talk to former presidents, from what I recall... and I still want to say it was on 60 Minutes... Clinton had actually discussed this and related issues with Carter and Bush, Sr. just for the sake of feed back and guidance (few realizing how much old Bill actually relied on such chats... but it was probably safer than ask Hilary)
Okay, so let's say for a moment that Bill knew damn well the horror that UBL could drum up (I'm confident he did). And, let's say he told young George everything he knew (no doubt that happened). Finally, let's say George took him seriously and did everything he could to prevent him from attacking the U.S. What, in your opinion, could George have done differently? We have to keep in mind that from what I am aware, both Bill and George knew there could be a potential attack on the US, but they were not aware of the commercial airline hijack plot.
My personal opinion of that whole 9/11 issue stems from the FBI and CIA. Personally, I think that both departments knew things the other didn't, but at the time, neither one spoke to the other. (Supposedly the communication between them is better, but I still have my doubts.) Hence, crucial information that could have been pieced together went undetected. Perhaps this thread is going off in the wrong direction...
I know for fact that both agencies knew things as did Interpol and Scotland Yard but for political reasons more than anything other, the children refused to share intelligence and their pettiness resulted in over 3,000 deaths.
From what I understand Jr. knew there was a problem but he was already focus on Iraq (and didn't see Al Queda as being much of an issue) and the only thing he wanted was to find a "legal" way to go back into that country and kill Sadam. He was talking about this and the oil conquests early in his campaign but was hushed up by his handlers at least twice, but it was a known element to his agenda and his courting the big oil companies made it an obligation. Regardless, this is what supposedly kept him distracted as did the whole Supreme Court drama around the election... personally, if 9/11 hadn't happened I'd be a major investigation would have been launched into how he got in, etc. but that's another issue entirely.
I believe that we had most of the puzzle parts but no one was willing to sit down at the same game table to assemble them... I think we do this sort of thing all the time even though it's been seriously squelched since 9/11 and some of the steps Jr & Co. took so as to force a more open door relationship amongst each agency.
The one other thing that disturbs me on this issue is the relationship the Bush family has with Bin Laden's parents and siblings... (insert Twilight Zone music here).
I'm pretty sure that if you compare your post with mine above it, they say pretty much the same thing, except what Bush could have done to prevent the plot of hijacking a commercial airliner and flying them into the WTC, etc.
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