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Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Discuss PseudoSkeptics and their Fallacies. Share strategies for debating them.

Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Yes
28
62%
Yes but only limit them to the Debating Skeptics board
10
22%
No, it would only bring negative energy and ultimately do no good, as they will not listen
7
16%
 
Total votes : 45

Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby SeanRMR » 22 Jul 2009, 13:29

I voted yes as I guess I am one of those skeptics. But I will try not say someone is wrong on these boards but try not to get annoyed if I ask well what if that could be explained this way. It can only help you guys the way I see it as you can then go aha but that can't be the case because of these facts. That's all I like facts.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Scepcop » 23 Jul 2009, 01:06

SeanRMR wrote:I voted yes as I guess I am one of those skeptics. But I will try not say someone is wrong on these boards but try not to get annoyed if I ask well what if that could be explained this way. It can only help you guys the way I see it as you can then go aha but that can't be the case because of these facts. That's all I like facts.


Hi SeanRMR,

Well feel free to start a reasoned debate. There are intelligent skeptics out there. But when they start to deny the facts, stories, examples, evidence, etc., the kind that I and Eteponge post about, then they reveal their inherent closed mindedness and faith based denial.

Let me give you another example of how a true skeptic behaves vs a pseudo-skeptic (remember that EVERY skeptic claims to be a true skeptic, the proof is in their actions).

Regarding Atlantis, a true skeptic who objectively weighs evidence will simply say:

"There is not sufficient evidence for me to believe in Atlantis. Therefore I deem is unproven and perhaps unprovable."

A pseudo-skeptic or dogmatist debunker (e.g. James Randi, Richard Dawkins) on the other hand, would say this instead:

"Atlantis doesn't exist. It's a pure fantasy made up by ancient people. Only nutcases believe in it."

Do you see the difference between those two reactions? One is evidence based, the other is a personal subjective rant with an agenda. Can you guess which one is which?

Which one of the two statements would you think the super logical Mr. Spock would say? Obviously the former.

What I don't get is why these "skeptics" are only skeptic of anything against the establishment, and not of any of the claims of orthodoxy, even if they are totally unsupported or in some cases contradicted by the facts?

For example, skeptics take the official 9/11 story as Gospel Truth, when in fact the FBI has even publicly admitted that they have "no hard evidence linking Osama Bin Laden to 9/11", and the White House's evidence linking Bin Laden to 9/11 has never been publicly released. So it's illogical and nonsensical for evidence based skeptics then to take it as Gospel Truth, like Michael Shermer does, especially since the government has has a history of lying and false flag operations in the past.

Highly illogical.

Can you make sense out of it or defend this absurd behavior that defies reason?

Where has Randi or Shermer ever criticized orthodoxy or anything the government does?

These are the kind of valid questions that true skeptics and truth seekers ask. Yet these organized skeptics never ask such challenging questions. Instead, they obey orthodoxy as Gospel Truth, and attack/ridicule anything that opposes it. Is that true skepticism to you?
“Devotion to the truth is the hallmark of morality; there is no greater, nobler, more heroic form of devotion than the act of a man who assumes the responsibility of thinking.” - Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Franc28 » 23 Jul 2009, 04:14

What I don't get is why these "skeptics" are only skeptic of anything against the establishment, and not of any of the claims of orthodoxy, even if they are totally unsupported or in some cases contradicted by the facts?


That is my main beef with it as well. The main reason why I think skepticism is nothing more than an Establishment ideology.

However, I must give you a caveat: Shermer has become a libertarian now, and so he's less of a State cheerleader than he used to be.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby General Zod » 23 Jul 2009, 04:20

It's your forum- so it's your right to provide a platform for whomever you want, and ban whomever you want.

FWIW, my suggestion is to welcome skeptics to post here, and treat us the same as you would expect to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Franc28 » 23 Jul 2009, 04:29

"treat us the same as you would expect to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum."

Get ganged on by fifty people at a time?

:lol:

Are you a skeptic as well? I am looking forward to debating skeptics, especially since I was banned from the JREF forum.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Scepcop » 23 Jul 2009, 04:38

Franc28 wrote:
What I don't get is why these "skeptics" are only skeptic of anything against the establishment, and not of any of the claims of orthodoxy, even if they are totally unsupported or in some cases contradicted by the facts?


That is my main beef with it as well. The main reason why I think skepticism is nothing more than an Establishment ideology.

However, I must give you a caveat: Shermer has become a libertarian now, and so he's less of a State cheerleader than he used to be.


Sure a skeptic can be a libertarian, but that only means he believes in less government intrusion into people's personal lives. But conspiracies, cover ups, lies, false flag operations (Gulf of Tonkin), staged terrorism (e.g. Operation Northwoods) are another matter, and so far, these skeptics have not given them any credence, even if they are supported by documented facts.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Scepcop » 23 Jul 2009, 04:40

General Zod wrote:It's your forum- so it's your right to provide a platform for whomever you want, and ban whomever you want.

FWIW, my suggestion is to welcome skeptics to post here, and treat us the same as you would expect to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum.


General Zod? Like that villain from Superman II? Where is Ursula and Non? lol j/k

Anyway, how did five skeptics join this forum in one day? Are you all coming from a link someone posted somewhere on a site? Or did you plan this as a coordinated thing?
“Devotion to the truth is the hallmark of morality; there is no greater, nobler, more heroic form of devotion than the act of a man who assumes the responsibility of thinking.” - Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Scepcop » 23 Jul 2009, 04:41

Franc28 wrote:"treat us the same as you would expect to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum."

Get ganged on by fifty people at a time?

:lol:

Are you a skeptic as well? I am looking forward to debating skeptics, especially since I was banned from the JREF forum.


LOL Franc28. I think he meant "treat us the same as you would WANT to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum". But yeah, good one.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby SeanRMR » 23 Jul 2009, 05:02

Well I came in through a link posted by the professor the others not sure not psychic. But at a rough guess I would say Azreal got here that way as well.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby Scepcop » 23 Jul 2009, 05:13

SeanRMR wrote:Well I came in through a link posted by the professor the others not sure not psychic. But at a rough guess I would say Azreal got here that way as well.


Where was the link posted that you came through? On Youtube or the JREF forums?
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby General Zod » 23 Jul 2009, 05:33

Franc28 wrote:"treat us the same as you would expect to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum."

Get ganged on by fifty people at a time?

:lol:

Are you a skeptic as well? I am looking forward to debating skeptics, especially since I was banned from the JREF forum.


Plenty of non-skeptics post at the JREF forum, and I know at least three skeptics who have been banned there. My own experience is that the gloves come off fast when you start making claims you can't back up with evidence. I wouldn't expect to be treated differently here if I disagreed with everyone.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby General Zod » 23 Jul 2009, 05:38

Scepcop wrote:
Franc28 wrote:"treat us the same as you would expect to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum."

Get ganged on by fifty people at a time?

:lol:

Are you a skeptic as well? I am looking forward to debating skeptics, especially since I was banned from the JREF forum.


LOL Franc28. I think he meant "treat us the same as you would WANT to be treated if you joined a skeptics' forum". But yeah, good one.


As a matter of fact, that's not at all what I meant. If I started making posts on this forum disputing paranormal claims, I would expect the same reception that you would be likely to get on a skeptics' forum.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby General Zod » 23 Jul 2009, 05:40

Scepcop wrote:
General Zod wrote:Anyway, how did five skeptics join this forum in one day? Are you all coming from a link someone posted somewhere on a site? Or did you plan this as a coordinated thing?


The marching orders came through from NWO headquarters.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby SeanRMR » 23 Jul 2009, 06:59

Scepcop wrote:
SeanRMR wrote:Well I came in through a link posted by the professor the others not sure not psychic. But at a rough guess I would say Azreal got here that way as well.


Where was the link posted that you came through? On Youtube or the JREF forums?


neither It is on almost every thread in the skeptics section of the magic cafe. I don't post to much on the JREF forum as most of my points I want to say are usually already there and if I can't back my post up there I won't do it seen to many people on all sides get destroyed without evidence I don't want to be one of them.

So yes in threads other then this one when I make a claim I'll be prepared to back it up with evidence. When I make a suggestion I will not always have evidence but would love to help make those suggestions into tests to see if they're a factor. Anecdotes have there place but will not always be enough to sway me. I hope that clears up my position of how I want to behave hear some kind of mutual respect I won't talk for other skeptics as I'm not them nor am I a leader of anything.
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Re: Poll: Should Skeptics be allowed in this forum?

Postby antiskeptic » 23 Jul 2009, 10:07

General Zod, I think that you should apologize for making fun of the NWO conspiracy theories. It was disrespectful and some of us believe in them.
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