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Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so stop it

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Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so stop it

Postby Scepcop » 24 Oct 2010, 04:01

Skeptics,
Galileo was not one of you, so quit that ridiculous claim to try to make yourselves look better. He was not an Atheist. And he challenged the establishment. You guys do NOT. And he believes in both science and God at the same time. You guys don't. So quit trying to make him out to be one of you. He would never have approved of the Randis and Shermers.

Same with Newton. He believed in God. None of these guys were Atheists.

So quit the scam.

“Devotion to the truth is the hallmark of morality; there is no greater, nobler, more heroic form of devotion than the act of a man who assumes the responsibility of thinking.” - Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby derrida » 24 Oct 2010, 04:33

you dont need to be an atheist to be a skeptic
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Arouet » 24 Oct 2010, 04:37

Scepcop: I know you don't understand this but atheism and not challenging the establishment are not part of the definition of skepticism. And just because we're skeptical of some things, doesn't mean we apply it all 'round. Additionally, Newton, IIRC, attempted more than most people to try and get to god through rational thinking.

I'm happy to include them in the pantheon of skepticism.

By the way, why do you abandon so many threads just to start half a dozen new ones, that you'll soon abandon too? Are you not interested in spirited debate? Any true skeptic wants his idea challenged vigourously. It's the only way to see if they can withstand opposition.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Arouet » 24 Oct 2010, 04:39

By the way, Scepcop, can you change the setting where when someone else has posted while you write your post, when you press submit it doesn't send by rather asks you if you want to change your post? half the time I don't realise its done that and just assume my message was sent? We can look back up to see if people posted in the mean time. I'd rather risk missing reading a post than risk losing a post I've taken time to type up!
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby really? » 24 Oct 2010, 19:48

Actually I don't think Scepcop wants his ideas challenged.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby caniswalensis » 24 Oct 2010, 21:34

I honestly can't remember anybody claiming that Galileo and/or Newton were athiests. I would consider it both odd and extrememely misinformed if such a claim was made. Newton in particular was a fervantly religious person and spent a good deal of time towards the end of his life trying to find some sort of mathimatical code in the bible tht would objectively prove the exsistence of God.

I am at a loss to discern what anyone would gain by claiming these two men were athiests. Skepcop, Can you give an example of someone claiming this? What were they trying to show with such a claim? In short, what is the scam you are referring to?

regards, Canis
"It is proper for you to doubt ... do not go upon report ... do not go upon tradition ... do not go upon hear-say." ~ Buddha
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Scepcop » 24 Oct 2010, 23:21

caniswalensis wrote:I honestly can't remember anybody claiming that Galileo and/or Newton were athiests. I would consider it both odd and extrememely misinformed if such a claim was made. Newton in particular was a fervantly religious person and spent a good deal of time towards the end of his life trying to find some sort of mathimatical code in the bible tht would objectively prove the exsistence of God.

I am at a loss to discern what anyone would gain by claiming these two men were athiests. Skepcop, Can you give an example of someone claiming this? What were they trying to show with such a claim? In short, what is the scam you are referring to?

regards, Canis


Every book with new ideas uses the Galileo analogy.

The pseudoskeptics use it too. They consider Galileo to be one of their champions and also to be one of them. He was not.

Galileo did not believe that all paranormal/supernatural was bunk or cite any pseudoskeptical mantras that Randi and Shermer do. Thus he is not one of them.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Scepcop » 24 Oct 2010, 23:23

Arouet wrote:By the way, Scepcop, can you change the setting where when someone else has posted while you write your post, when you press submit it doesn't send by rather asks you if you want to change your post? half the time I don't realise its done that and just assume my message was sent? We can look back up to see if people posted in the mean time. I'd rather risk missing reading a post than risk losing a post I've taken time to type up!


That doesn't happen very often. I'm not sure how to change it though, but I will check the admin panel.

But come on now. Even when it does happen, just click the submit button again. Don't assume that your post was sent if you don't see the confirmation message.

Or, after you write a post, before sending push Control A and Control C to select all your text and copy it into memory in case something goes wrong with the submission. That way you can paste it again if you need to.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Scepcop » 24 Oct 2010, 23:27

Arouet wrote:Scepcop: I know you don't understand this but atheism and not challenging the establishment are not part of the definition of skepticism. And just because we're skeptical of some things, doesn't mean we apply it all 'round. Additionally, Newton, IIRC, attempted more than most people to try and get to god through rational thinking.

I'm happy to include them in the pantheon of skepticism.

By the way, why do you abandon so many threads just to start half a dozen new ones, that you'll soon abandon too? Are you not interested in spirited debate? Any true skeptic wants his idea challenged vigourously. It's the only way to see if they can withstand opposition.


Because arguing the same points in an endless circle is not productive. And if you do that, your whole day is gone. Time goes by faster when you're on the computer. Forums can get addicting when you keep up with every thread. And I have another site to tend to. Etc. Besides, your posts are predictable. After the same arguments get repeated, then it's reached the impasse.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby derrida » 24 Oct 2010, 23:41

Scepcop wrote:
Arouet wrote:Scepcop: I know you don't understand this but atheism and not challenging the establishment are not part of the definition of skepticism. And just because we're skeptical of some things, doesn't mean we apply it all 'round. Additionally, Newton, IIRC, attempted more than most people to try and get to god through rational thinking.

I'm happy to include them in the pantheon of skepticism.

By the way, why do you abandon so many threads just to start half a dozen new ones, that you'll soon abandon too? Are you not interested in spirited debate? Any true skeptic wants his idea challenged vigourously. It's the only way to see if they can withstand opposition.


Because arguing the same points in an endless circle is not productive. And if you do that, your whole day is gone. Time goes by faster when you're on the computer. Forums can get addicting when you keep up with every thread. And I have another site to tend to. Etc. Besides, your posts are predictable. After the same arguments get repeated, then it's reached the impasse.


you mean after somebody questions your rationality and debunks your statement?
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Arouet » 25 Oct 2010, 00:26

Scepcop wrote:
caniswalensis wrote:I honestly can't remember anybody claiming that Galileo and/or Newton were athiests. I would consider it both odd and extrememely misinformed if such a claim was made. Newton in particular was a fervantly religious person and spent a good deal of time towards the end of his life trying to find some sort of mathimatical code in the bible tht would objectively prove the exsistence of God.

I am at a loss to discern what anyone would gain by claiming these two men were athiests. Skepcop, Can you give an example of someone claiming this? What were they trying to show with such a claim? In short, what is the scam you are referring to?

regards, Canis


Every book with new ideas uses the Galileo analogy.

The pseudoskeptics use it too. They consider Galileo to be one of their champions and also to be one of them. He was not.

Galileo did not believe that all paranormal/supernatural was bunk or cite any pseudoskeptical mantras that Randi and Shermer do. Thus he is not one of them.



Pamaly Gay (http://www.starstryder.com/) an astronomy professor and co-host of astronomy cast is a well known and accepted skeptic. She is also a Christian.

Atheism != skepticism

And someone can be a skeptic in general while still having some blind spots.

The skeptical community is quite diverse, with all sorts of ideas floating around.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby JordanNitro » 31 Jul 2011, 04:07

But there are atheists who believe in the paranormal too. The ones who rule out or "rationalize" away the paranormal I give them the label materialistic atheist. Materialistic as in the philosophical definition of that, not meaning materialistic in behavior. Paranormal believing atheists I just call them non-materialistic atheists. I think all Buddhists would be non-materialistic atheists because their religions fully believes in ghosts.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Craig Browning » 01 Aug 2011, 00:00

derrida wrote:you dont need to be an atheist to be a skeptic


There was a time I'd agree with you on that statement, not so in today's clime however where an all or nothing position is the tone. For that matter I can't see how anyone religious could be accepted by the skeptic's community given their dependence on faith and more so, faith in the miraculous, much of which mirrors every single ability associated with the Psychic world, mind you.

By today's black & white position within what other skeptics are calling "fanatical skepticism" one has no choice but to be pure Atheist if not evangelically so. Otherwise you will be taunted and persecuted until you take that "ultimate" step.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby Arouet » 01 Aug 2011, 00:09

Craig Browning wrote:For that matter I can't see how anyone religious could be accepted by the skeptic's community given their dependence on faith


Wrong again Craig. Google Pamela Gay.
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Re: Skeptics, Galileo and Newton were NOT one of you, so sto

Postby ProfWag » 01 Aug 2011, 00:27

Arouet wrote:
Craig Browning wrote:For that matter I can't see how anyone religious could be accepted by the skeptic's community given their dependence on faith


Wrong again Craig. Google Pamela Gay.

I'm afraid I must agree with Arouet. Why can't a skeptic be a theist? As I've mentioned elsewhere, skepticism is a method to a conclusion and not a belief system. Skeptics can, and do, keep an open mind to everything as new conclusions can always be reached. Sounds to me that you're saying a believer must believe in UFOs, bigfoot, astrology, and TK. Yet, many people believe in one and not the other. Why? They used skepticism to reach that conclusion. I may be 99.5% atheist, but when my parents died, you can bet your sweet ass I prayed that they were going to heaven...just in case...and I'll bet there weren't very many skeptics who would have told me to stop praying.
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