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Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby EnfieldWasLegit » 27 May 2010, 14:30

Elton John used to be married- to a woman! Are you being serious when you claim he is gay? Anyway, the comment about dressing yourself was meant as a good natured jab, not to pick a fight. But what did you mean with that comment? I really couldn't figure out what you were getting at.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ProfWag » 27 May 2010, 20:50

EnfieldWasLegit wrote:Elton John used to be married- to a woman! Are you being serious when you claim he is gay? Anyway, the comment about dressing yourself was meant as a good natured jab, not to pick a fight. But what did you mean with that comment? I really couldn't figure out what you were getting at.

I don't know if your Elton question was serious or not, but being a huge EJ fan, I can assure you he's very much gay and now "married" to David Furnish. I did meet him and his wife backstage back in 1986 though. She was pretty hot if I say so myself.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby EnfieldWasLegit » 27 May 2010, 21:40

How did you get to meet them? That's very cool.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ciscop » 27 May 2010, 22:09

EnfieldWasLegit wrote:Elton John used to be married- to a woman! Are you being serious when you claim he is gay? Anyway, the comment about dressing yourself was meant as a good natured jab, not to pick a fight. But what did you mean with that comment? I really couldn't figure out what you were getting at.


then i am sorry

i was talking about the ramblings of craig
he rambles about nothing and sometimes i do believe he is doing either peyote or lsd
cause he is just typing and typing and he doesnt makes sense

in this case for example
he acuses me of exposing his magic trick
i didnt exposed anything, i just posted a link
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ciscop » 28 May 2010, 03:52

by the way
here you can see the whole clip



do you prefer this version craig?

there´s also the short version



here is a thread of magician´s discussing the illusion
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewtopic.php?topic=270761&forum=7

isnt it cute?
how´s your team of lawyers doing?

:lol:
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ProfWag » 28 May 2010, 04:01

EnfieldWasLegit wrote:How did you get to meet them? That's very cool.

London, Wembley Arena, July 1986, Princess Diana Trust night. About an hour and a half after the concert, my buddy and I were lost trying to find the tube station which was closed by the time we got there so we walked back to the Arena hoping to find someone that could tell us where to go and walked through an open fence and the next thing you knew, there was Elton, Phil Collins, Princess Diana, George Michael, and a host of other people. Elton signed a personalized autograph which I still have on my mantle (To Wag, Best Wishes, Elton John). I then followed Princess Di out to her Rolls and her dress was just short enough that when she spread her legs to get in the back seat, I saw...
How many people can say that, eh?
Finally got a ride back to our B&B from Elton's agent which was pretty cool also.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby EnfieldWasLegit » 28 May 2010, 05:49

Yeah right. And next you're gonna tell me George Michael is gay as well. Seriously, that is a great story. Lucky you.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ciscop » 28 May 2010, 06:05

,
Last edited by ciscop on 28 May 2010, 22:15, edited 1 time in total.
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby mmreed » 28 May 2010, 22:10

I posted this in a different thread, but I see it is very relevant here as well...

Actually, regurgitating exposure is nearly as bad as the exposure itself.

When folks post things like this is become viral, and damaging. Yes the performer exposed some of it. But by continual posting of this, ciscop is pretty much "exposing by proxy"

As a magician, mentalist, whatever term you choose, it is our responsibility to safeguard the secrets of the arts, and hold them in respect. This means that if some assclown on TV exposes something, that you do not foster promotion of it.

Granted there is no real legal recourse in posting a link of this nature, but it comes down to ethics and doing the right thing. People spend a great deal of time and money developing effects, and this type of "proxied exposure" serves nothing positive. It only serves to continue the exposure, and feed the knock off makers with ideas of how things are done.

Reading over all of the posts, I will step out and say that I think much of this "proxied exposure" is a result of people needing to feed their own egos... a "look at me!!" cry for attention. When you break it down to the basic psychological level, its really no different than a tattle tale running to mommy in a need for attention and some type of false feedback to help them feel important.

Forums are a funny thing - they seem to be the "Popeye's Spinach" for the egomaniacs.

Those of you out there reading this thread, understand that the right thing to do in matters of exposure is to simply not pass it along. It will only serve to damage the community. It does nothing positive. Conduct yourself with class and be respectful of others intellectual creations. You will only come out the winner by doing so.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ciscop » 28 May 2010, 22:15

how are you doing craig?
why another account?

hey craig browning
have you seen this longer version of your trick
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby mmreed » 28 May 2010, 22:34

If you are referring to me as "one of Craig's other accounts" you are sorely incorrect.

And again, I refer you to my first post regarding this video.

It seems you have an ego that needs severe stroking, but I ask that you consider re-evaluating your stance on seeking it in this manner. You are doing nothing but disservice to the magic community by "passing along this exposure".

Those that conduct themselves with class and ethics see this, and it only makes you look bad...

If you think it is perfectly acceptable, I suggest you speak with Marc DeSouzza, chairman of ethics for the SAM, or with Denny Haney - a long time respected magician and historian of magic. Maybe speak with Mark Kalin... or any of the serious pros... I think you will find every one of them would ask that you stop in this childish viral promotion of exposure and that you simply passing along the link is just as bad as exposure itself.

If you choose to spit in the face of the community and the ethics of wanting to safeguard the secrets of the arts - then that speaks volumes about you as not only a magician, but a person as well.

Step up and be confident in doing what it right.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ciscop » 29 May 2010, 00:24

Dude
i love magic
but i do laugh when i read about this notion of ¨ethics¨ in magic
i used to treasure my magic books
but now kids post the secrets on youtube and there´s people sharing every dvd and pdf on torrents
i remember seeing Daryl´s vhs tape, where he was doubting of teaching the double lift because it was such a strong move.. and now you have kids teaching it for free!..
so i really dont care about the secrets anymore, i know that after a performance it is inevitable that some people will google what i did and find it.. but who cares???

and like i said
i will only bust balls if they are calling themselves a psychic without a disclaimer
because there´s no such thing as a psychic, it is only people doing tricks of the trade
that for me is stepping over the line, so screw them all

and i am only posting this youtube clip, which is really funny to watch
cause craig browning called me names (i am really sensitive) and threaten to sue me which is going way to far!

it isnt an ego thing
i just find it really funny

by the way.. this is a 15k illusion??
peter loughran and christopher taylor sell illusions way cheaper and way more interesting for me (at least)
i think this illusion is a little bit overpriced now that it has been exposed in AGT.
look at this
i saw it live and i loved it
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby mmreed » 29 May 2010, 01:21

ciscop wrote:Dude

so i really dont care about the secrets anymore


and this is the same thinking the youtube kiddies have when posting exposure videos.

It speaks volumes of you and your respect (or lack thereof) for the arts and your maturity level in dealing with conflict.

Im sure the rest of those reading this clearly see the degraded and sleazy view you have of the art and how you treat it with such disrespect and disgruntlement.
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby ciscop » 29 May 2010, 01:44

so what if i dont care?
i should police around the internet and waste time tellingl kids to please stop posting their youtube videos?
thats what i should do?
sorry!!!

by the way, in case i am not explaining myself
i am saying
i do not care about the secrets, not that i will tell everybody how to do a booktest
thats a different issue
it also should tell you i care about the performance and performer, not the dirty stuff
the dirty stuff is only meaningfull for those that cant rely on their personality on stage
they need every little secret out there since they are boring and lack charisma.
sorry if i dont care about people knowing about the thumbtip

it is just lazy magicians that cant find ways to be entertaining that care about that sort of stuff
For every person who reads this valuable book there are hundreds of naïve souls who would prefer to have their spines tingled by a sensational but worthless potboiler by some hack journalist of the paranormal. You who now read these sentences join a small but wiser minority. Martin Gaardner (Psychology of the Psychic)
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Re: Whats worst for a magician? exposure or a bad performer

Postby mmreed » 29 May 2010, 02:08

ciscop wrote:it is just lazy magicians that cant find ways to be entertaining that care about that sort of stuff


Tell that to Mark Kalin and Jinger when you expose his illusions.
Tell that to Kevin James, or Murray Hatfield.
Tell that to Losander or Osborne.

folks built their entire careers on specific effects and illusions. With the attitude you have towards protecting the art's secrets, you spit in each of their faces.

and the folks you mention that do not rely on the art's secrets? They are called comedians... get it right kid.
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