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Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 25 Apr 2012, 04:59

Arouet wrote:I'm sorry, but you are going to have to spell out for me what you think the problem is with that act. I'm not even sure what act you are quoting from.


Let's start small... do you understand what a c'est vie qui trust is?

Do you recognize what the legal definition of person is?

Are you aware of what a corporation is?

Do you understand what the words assets, property and investments mean?

When you investigate claims do you verify the references?

But just in case your not blatently being obtuse... the name of that act (which i referenced directly to the department of justice website and there is no way you could miss it if you verified the references given...) is The Canadian Ownership and Control Determination act 1985.


Here's an article about it from the horses mouth.

Biography / Administrative history
The Petroleum Incentives Administration (PIA) was responsible for the administration of both the Petroleum Incentives Program Act and the Canadian Ownership and Control Determination Act, acts that were proclaimed in June and September, 1982, respectively. Under the terms of the Acts, the administration was broadly responsible for the collection, analysis and study of information pertaining to the determination of companies' and individuals' Canadian ownership rate and control status, and their eligibility for reimbursement of certain approved expenditures, as well as the development of policy and regulations.

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/pam_ ... nbr=190485
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 25 Apr 2012, 05:28

Arouet wrote:
cecil1 wrote:So... What's so unfathomable that a serial murderer rapes a victim?

Not an extreme leap of logic is it?

Not too hard to imagine is it?


I have no idea what you are referring to, but while it is not unfathomable that a serial murderer might rape a victim and it is not too hard to imagine, one cannot infer that because someone is a serial murderer that they are also likely a rapist as well.


How is this relevant? I have no idea what you are referring to.
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Arouet » 25 Apr 2012, 09:56

cecil1 wrote:Let's start small... do you understand what a c'est vie qui trust is?


No. And neither does google apparently. Are you sure you're writing it correctly.

Do you recognize what the legal definition of person is?

Are you aware of what a corporation is?

Do you understand what the words assets, property and investments mean?


Yes

When you investigate claims do you verify the references?


Generally, I try to, yes.

But just in case your not blatently being obtuse... the name of that act (which i referenced directly to the department of justice website and there is no way you could miss it if you verified the references given...) is The Canadian Ownership and Control Determination act 1985.


Here's an article about it from the horses mouth.

Biography / Administrative history
The Petroleum Incentives Administration (PIA) was responsible for the administration of both the Petroleum Incentives Program Act and the Canadian Ownership and Control Determination Act, acts that were proclaimed in June and September, 1982, respectively. Under the terms of the Acts, the administration was broadly responsible for the collection, analysis and study of information pertaining to the determination of companies' and individuals' Canadian ownership rate and control status, and their eligibility for reimbursement of certain approved expenditures, as well as the development of policy and regulations.

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/pam_ ... nbr=190485


You haven't made an actual argument. What is your problem with this act?
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Arouet » 25 Apr 2012, 09:57

cecil1 wrote:
Arouet wrote:
cecil1 wrote:So... What's so unfathomable that a serial murderer rapes a victim?

Not an extreme leap of logic is it?

Not too hard to imagine is it?


I have no idea what you are referring to, but while it is not unfathomable that a serial murderer might rape a victim and it is not too hard to imagine, one cannot infer that because someone is a serial murderer that they are also likely a rapist as well.


How is this relevant? I have no idea what you are referring to.


Are you just ****ing with us?
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Twain Shakespeare » 25 Apr 2012, 11:38

Why are people particularly inclined to make "9/11" the focus of conspiracy theories, rather than that day God said he would change my wife's life, the Pricks were first bombed, the Siege of Waco began (taking attention from the one day wonder of Wall St.) and my future wife and I were intentionally hit by a man in a car who was trying to kill us.

1. We have damn good reason to hate US and consider US the prime suspect in any crime.
2 Whereas the first bombing was drowned out in the ATFs war against the first Amendemnt, the events of 2001 were immediately used to damn homosexuals for making God angry at US, and to announce Wold War V, the Final Crusade, and then were officially blamed on Usama and Iraq, at least one of which was innocent.
3. Can you think of any reason I should believe anything the government doesn't deny?
"What's so Funny about Peace, Love, and Understanding?"
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby ProfWag » 25 Apr 2012, 20:53

Twain Shakespeare wrote:3. Can you think of any reason I should believe anything the government doesn't deny?

Other than the liberal media types who would like nothing better than to find fault with a Republican President or the conservative media types who go to great lengths to find dirt on Democratic presidents? Otherwise, your belief in the US Government is based on your own experiences and opinions--both of which are your own.
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 26 Apr 2012, 02:25

Arouet wrote:
cecil1 wrote:Let's start small... do you understand what a c'est vie qui trust is?


No. And neither does google apparently. Are you sure you're writing it correctly.

Google has changed it's policy on how search functions, here's my google search results.
http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&sourc ... KZE5eyhv8A

Do you recognize what the legal definition of person is?

Are you aware of what a corporation is?

Do you understand what the words assets, property and investments mean?


Yes


When you investigate claims do you verify the references?


Generally, I try to, yes.

But just in case your not blatently being obtuse... the name of that act (which i referenced directly to the department of justice website and there is no way you could miss it if you verified the references given...) is The Canadian Ownership and Control Determination act 1985.


Here's an article about it from the horses mouth.

Biography / Administrative history
The Petroleum Incentives Administration (PIA) was responsible for the administration of both the Petroleum Incentives Program Act and the Canadian Ownership and Control Determination Act, acts that were proclaimed in June and September, 1982, respectively. Under the terms of the Acts, the administration was broadly responsible for the collection, analysis and study of information pertaining to the determination of companies' and individuals' Canadian ownership rate and control status, and their eligibility for reimbursement of certain approved expenditures, as well as the development of policy and regulations.

http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/pam_ ... nbr=190485


You haven't made an actual argument. What is your problem with this act?


You would have to know what a trust is before you could figure that out.

I suggest you investigate what trusts are so you can learn how to obfuscate ownership and wealth otherwise you are not equipt to debate this at all, just as if you were ignorant of math, you would not be equipt to debate math issues.
I placed my google search results in the above quote in blue.
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 26 Apr 2012, 02:29

Arouet wrote:Are you just ****ing with us?


You're the one entering debate without knowledge on the topic, I ask you the same.
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 26 Apr 2012, 02:45

Twain Shakespeare wrote:Why are people particularly inclined to make "9/11" the focus of conspiracy theories, rather than that day God said he would change my wife's life, the Pricks were first bombed, the Siege of Waco began (taking attention from the one day wonder of Wall St.) and my future wife and I were intentionally hit by a man in a car who was trying to kill us.

1. We have damn good reason to hate US and consider US the prime suspect in any crime.
2 Whereas the first bombing was drowned out in the ATFs war against the first Amendemnt, the events of 2001 were immediately used to damn homosexuals for making God angry at US, and to announce Wold War V, the Final Crusade, and then were officially blamed on Usama and Iraq, at least one of which was innocent.
3. Can you think of any reason I should believe anything the government doesn't deny?



I have a damn good reason not to hate the US...
Actively hating the US or anything for that matter takes up valuable space in my mind, why rent it out to negativity? My life is far too valuable to let that occupy my time.
That doesn't mean I trust the US...
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Arouet » 26 Apr 2012, 04:17

cecil1 wrote:Let's start small... do you understand what a c'est vie qui trust is?


No. And neither does google apparently. Are you sure you're writing it correctly.

Google has changed it's policy on how search functions, here's my google search results.
http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&sourc ... KZE5eyhv8A


Ok, you did spell it wrong; I assume you're referring to a "cestui que trust" which simply means the beneficiary of a trust. Ok, yes, I know what it means.

I suggest you investigate what trusts are so you can learn how to obfuscate ownership and wealth otherwise you are not equipt to debate this at all, just as if you were ignorant of math, you would not be equipt to debate math issues.


I'm a lawyer, and while I don't practice in an area that deals with trusts, I do have a basic understanding of what they are. So feel free to go ahead with your argument for how we are legal slaves in Canada.
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Arouet » 26 Apr 2012, 04:21

cecil1 wrote:
Arouet wrote:Are you just ****ing with us?


You're the one entering debate without knowledge on the topic, I ask you the same.


So far it just seems that you're trolling. You've come in super aggressive but also writing in a manner that is completely obscure. I don't even know what we're debating because all you've done so far is list a few statutes, highlighted some sections without explaining why they are relevant, and have asserted that in Canada we are legal slaves.

I've suggested that you are making way too much out of the legal constructs that technically create the country and are drawing conclusions that aren't warranted.

As for the post I'm responding to here, I have no idea what you're going on about. You are either a troll, and just trying to get a rise out of people (August West perhaps?) or you have, with all due respect, not done a terribly good job of conveying your argument, so perhaps you could elaborate?
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Arouet » 26 Apr 2012, 04:24

(I do see that you have elaborated in the other thread, I'll see what you have to say there...)
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 26 Apr 2012, 21:26

Arouet wrote:
cecil1 wrote:
Arouet wrote:Are you just ****ing with us?


You're the one entering debate without knowledge on the topic, I ask you the same.


So far it just seems that you're trolling. You've come in super aggressive but also writing in a manner that is completely obscure. I don't even know what we're debating because all you've done so far is list a few statutes, highlighted some sections without explaining why they are relevant, and have asserted that in Canada we are legal slaves.

I've suggested that you are making way too much out of the legal constructs that technically create the country and are drawing conclusions that aren't warranted.

As for the post I'm responding to here, I have no idea what you're going on about. You are either a troll, and just trying to get a rise out of people (August West perhaps?) or you have, with all due respect, not done a terribly good job of conveying your argument, so perhaps you could elaborate?



Try investigating the claims...

You have not researched this topic one bit, you are completely ignorant of this act.

You speak rudely and ignorantly before confirming claims

read man...

Trust property
(3) For greater certainty, for the purposes of this Act, a separate trust exists with respect to all assets, investments or property
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts ... lText.html

You can call me all the names you like that doesn't change this act or make you right.
For one who is completely in the dark on this topic you sure act like a know it all jerk.

Have fun not owning ALL your property investments and assets.
OHHH CANADAAAAAAAAAA where Arouet is not FREEEE
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby Arouet » 26 Apr 2012, 21:45

cecil1 wrote:Try investigating the claims...

You have not researched this topic one bit, you are completely ignorant of this act.

You speak rudely and ignorantly before confirming claims

read man...

Trust property
(3) For greater certainty, for the purposes of this Act, a separate trust exists with respect to all assets, investments or property
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts ... lText.html

You can call me all the names you like that doesn't change this act or make you right.
For one who is completely in the dark on this topic you sure act like a know it all jerk.

Have fun not owning ALL your property investments and assets.
OHHH CANADAAAAAAAAAA where Arouet is not FREEEE


I haven't called you names at all. (well, I've asked whether you are a troll because you come in all hyper-aggressive and insulting as well as being cryptic which is a characteristic of many trolls). As for being a jerk, I'm not the one who has come in insulting people.

As for knowing about this topic, I do know something about this topic - though admittedly it has been awhile since my law school days. But that's besides the point, because you actually haven't made an argument. You've said: see! Look at this Act! It's bad! It's immoral! But you haven't actually said why, or provided a concrete example of how this immoraility plays out. It is true in Canada that at its base, real property belongs to the crown. For example, if you pass away with no heirs the assets will revert to the crown.

That said, you haven't actually explained why you think that is immoral, or how it results in unfair situations. You've asked me to research the issue but you haven't actually made an argument as to how the issue is important or how you think it should be changed or why you think it should be changed. What is broken about the system? Do you see abuses by the government due to this obscure legal provision? You seem to be getting worked up over a legal fiction that really doesn't impact on people's lives in any significant way. You certainly haven't even come close to making the case of Canadians being "legal slaves".
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Re: Why Do Conspiracies Have so Much Appeal?

Postby cecil1 » 26 Apr 2012, 21:58

Arouet wrote:
cecil1 wrote:Try investigating the claims...

You have not researched this topic one bit, you are completely ignorant of this act.

You speak rudely and ignorantly before confirming claims

read man...

Trust property
(3) For greater certainty, for the purposes of this Act, a separate trust exists with respect to all assets, investments or property
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts ... lText.html

You can call me all the names you like that doesn't change this act or make you right.
For one who is completely in the dark on this topic you sure act like a know it all jerk.

Have fun not owning ALL your property investments and assets.
OHHH CANADAAAAAAAAAA where Arouet is not FREEEE


I haven't called you names at all. (well, I've asked whether you are a troll because you come in all hyper-aggressive and insulting as well as being cryptic which is a characteristic of many trolls). As for being a jerk, I'm not the one who has come in insulting people.

As for knowing about this topic, I do know something about this topic - though admittedly it has been awhile since my law school days. But that's besides the point, because you actually haven't made an argument. You've said: see! Look at this Act! It's bad! It's immoral! But you haven't actually said why, or provided a concrete example of how this immoraility plays out. It is true in Canada that at its base, real property belongs to the crown. For example, if you pass away with no heirs the assets will revert to the crown.

That said, you haven't actually explained why you think that is immoral, or how it results in unfair situations. You've asked me to research the issue but you haven't actually made an argument as to how the issue is important or how you think it should be changed or why you think it should be changed. What is broken about the system? Do you see abuses by the government due to this obscure legal provision? You seem to be getting worked up over a legal fiction that really doesn't impact on people's lives in any significant way. You certainly haven't even come close to making the case of Canadians being "legal slaves".


You haven't read the act or even investigated the claims, you are not a skeptic your an arm chair skeptic. =/
Ducking your head in the sand and crying your wrong you havent made your case when the evidence is right in front of your nose is not going to work with me sorry.
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