SCEPCOP Forum

I was going to report justin's post but given the response from the site owner...

I watched this one almost a year ago and I don't remember very much of it but it was positive.

Revisionist History of Nazi Germany
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOEM_xOGE8U


I just noticed that there is a part 2 and part 3.

Revisionist Interpretation of Nazi Germany, 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMJQeg4xYoc

Revisionist View of Nazi Germany, 3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkf94miR ... J5e61ajhwA


I've only watched the first few minutes of part 2 and it looks pretty objective.

Interesting thread about a very important topic. I'm going to try to read the whole thing from the beginning when I have some more time. So far what I've seen is remarkably civil. This is a topic that is forbidden to discuss on most internet forums. When it is allowed, it usually devolves into accusations of antisemitism answered by antisemitic statements about Jewish control. Before I start commenting on specific points, I'll tell you my overall feelings about the topic most people call "Holocaust denial."

First, the Holocaust is not one big cohesive historic event that either happened or didn't happen. It was tens of thousands of little events that happened to millions of people across a continent over a period of several years. If one particular aspect of it turns out to be false, the whole thing isn't proven false. If it is shown that gas chambers at Auschwitz didn't exist that doesn't mean that Jews were not rounded up and put into ghettos. If the Nazis didn't really make lampshades out of human skin, that doesn't mean there were no gas chambers at Treblinka.

There are people today who believe that the United States may have had warning of the impending attack on Pearl Harbor. Some people say that Japan had some legitimate disagreements with US foreign policy that justified a preemptive strike on the United States. But somebody who disputes the belief that the attack on Pearl Harbor was an unprovoked, surprise attack on peace-loving Americans by the barbaric Japanese warmongers is not accused of denying the attack on Pearl Harbor. Some historians believe the American Civil War was fought over the issue of slavery. These historians might disagree vehemently with somebody who disagrees with them but they don't accuse somebody who says that "states rights" was the real reason of "denying the Civil War." Same thing with the Holocaust. Saying that some of it didn't happen isn't the same as saying that none of it happened.

On the antisemitic nature of questioning the Holocaust: Holocaust denial or revision or whatever you call it isn't antisemitic. For one thing, the Holocaust isn't something that happened only to the Jews. If it's true that the Holocaust involves the Roma, the handicapped, homosexual, etc., then antisemitism can't be the only reason anybody would question it. Secondly, if somebody really does hate the Jews, there are many ways to express this hated that are more offensive and vile (and effective) than to say that six million of them weren't exterminated. Third, if it's true that Nazis didn't make shrunken heads out of Polish prisoners, or that they didn't throw Jews into the ovens alive, or that they didn't murder them in steam chambers at Treblinka, or even in gas chambers at Auschwitz, it's not antisemitic to say so. Truth isn't antisemitic, it's not pro-Semitic, nor is it Semitic neutral. Truth is truth.

Just my thoughts......

Good thoughts and well written, Mary Lee. The important thing is to have a dialogue without prejudice or ad hominem attacks.

I just watched this two part video.

David Irving Interview - Part 1 - An Independent Mind (2008)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6v7eP9idcc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uC9MT_WV4Co

I learned in that video that there is a large text of Hitler's actual words in existence. Here it is.
http://www.archive.org/stream/HitlersTa ... k_djvu.txt

I haven't had time to read it yet.

I've read a little of the text. Check this out.

(excerpt)
-----------------------------------------------
We'll take the southern part of the Ukraine, especially the
Crimea, and make it an exclusively German colony. There'll be
no harm in pushing out the population that's there now. The
German colonist will be the soldier-peasant, and for that I'll
take professional soldiers, whatever their line may have been
previously.
-----------------------------------------------

He said that in July of 1941 shortly after the invasion had begun.

Look what he said here.

(excerpt)
--------------------------------------------
The German colonist ought to live on handsome, spacious
farms. The German services will be lodged in marvellous
buildings, the governors in palaces. Beneath the shelter of the
administrative services, we shall gradually organise all that is
indispensable to the maintenance of a certain standard of
hving. Around the city, to a depth of thirty to forty kilometres,
we shall have a belt of handsome villages connected by the best
roads. What exists beyond that will be another world, in which
we mean to let the Russians live as they like. It is merely
necessary that we should rule them. In the event of a revolu-
tion, we shall only have to drop a few bombs on their cities, and
the affair will be liquidated. Once a year we shall lead a troop
of Kirghizes through the capital of the Reich, in order to strike
their imaginations with the size of our monuments.

What India was for England, the territories of Russia will be
for us. If only I could make the German people understand
what this space means for our future! Colonies are a pre-
carious possession, but this ground is safely ours.
--------------------------------------------

He's definitely talking like an imperialist.

Check out this quote.

(excerpt)
---------------------------------------------
The struggle for the hegemony of the world will be decided
in favour of Europe by the possession of the Russian space.
Thus Europe will be an impregnable fortress, safe from all
threat of blockade. All this opens up economic vistas which,
one may think, will incline the most liberal of the Western
democrats towards the New Order.
---------------------------------------------

It sounds like he really did want to take over the world.

...but later, he said this.

http://www.archive.org/stream/HitlersTa ... k_djvu.txt
(excerpt)
----------------------------------
To-day everybody is dreaming of a world peace conference.
For my part, I prefer to wage war for another ten years rather
than be cheated thus of the spoils of victory. In any case, my
demands are not exorbitant. I'm only interested, when all is
said, in territories where Germans have lived before.
----------------------------------

First he says one thing. Then, he says another.

I suppose it's possible that it's a bogus work. I googled around and found this.

http://www.amazon.com/Hitlers-Table-Tal ... AHCD7VBDI8
(excerpt)
---------------------------------
Here we have a book about a dictator being recorded during his regime. The book also ''contains'' writings, documents and other ''proves''.
We all know how dictators were. To believe that somebody will record a dictator during his speeches and his words on meetings , to me, is very hard to believe. It says in Europe that ''in the office of a dictator not even the fly is breathing''. Another question...record him with what ? We are talking about the 30's to 40's when not even tapes were on the market. Also, his opinion on Christianity or Catholicism in this book are way different than his opinions in Mein Kampf.
Also we know that Hitler was an anti semitic person. However , in this book, he is ''saying'' that the Pagan of Rome , Julian was a very ''great person''. However, Julian was very pro- Jewish and pro- Israel and he actually did wanted to rebuild the Jewish Temple.
I just think we are dealing with another great writer than just wanted to make some money.
And if i look at the prices from these sellers...
---------------------------------

At the 1:45 time mark of this video...

Free Speech - David Irving 1 of 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c82WPNFBNnM

...David Irving says that millions of Jews were shot by German soldiers on the Eastern front. Revisionists don't deny that the Germans killed Jews. They just say they never used gas chambers to do it.

Here's another on-line book I just came across.

"The Myth of German Villiany" by Brenton Bradburry

http://books.google.es/books?id=Lz8vNz4 ... ng&f=false


I wish I had time to read all of these on-line books I keep finding.

Here's another video I just came across.

"Amazing Adolf Hitler Speech - Bromberg Massacres - 1939"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV-zcaJaf9w

There are links to more videos there.


Here's some more info.
http://www.saveyourheritage.com/bloody_sunday.htm
http://www.saveyourheritage.com/history_of_poland.htm


I wasn't there so this is all second-hand information but at least we know what the German government was telling the German people. They weren't telling the German people what Americans are taught that they were telling the German people. That's one confirmed lie. We shouldn't rule out the possibility that there are other lies.