View Active Topics          Latest 100 Topics          View Your Posts          Switch to Mobile

Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Discuss Conspiracies and Cover Ups - e.g. 9/11 Truth, JFK Assassination, New World Order, Roswell, Moon Hoax, Secret Societies, etc. whatever conspiracy floats your boat.

Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 05 Feb 2014, 22:32

I'm still trying to wrap my hands around the thought of why people think the landings on the moon were faked in a studio.
As such, I'm going to try to start from scratch and start topics on the main issues of the conspiracy and see what I can come up with. I realize this will re-hash some of the same things we've already talked about, but trying to watch 91 videos is simply too daunting of a task so if you have some valid points, let's try to keep in simple if you don't mind. Also, I personally won't watch youtube videos so please just post answers or links to written statements. Youtube videos leave the reader with nothing to verify for reference and substantiate. If your answer is from a youtube video, that's fine, but please just write what was said (and the reference, if there was one.)

Yes, it's true that I don't believe the hoax for one second, but I'd really like to find out what makes those that do believe think the way they do. This is an honest attempt to begin anew and try to actually understand. I will also do my absolute best to stay on topic and not resort to ad hominem attacks and would appreciate the same in return. So if the readers do not mind, let's start with the question in the subject line:

It is my assertion that too many people would have had to have been involved that it doesn't pass my common sense test that so many people could have kept it secret. So, first question, in your opinion, how many people would have actually had to have known about the moon hoax to pull it off and keep it a "secret?"
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54






Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby FatFreddy » 06 Feb 2014, 04:13

I dealt with these issues in the fifteenth post from the top on this other thread.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3145


The anomalies in the pictures and footage are simply too clear. Here's another one...
http://www.aulis.com/stereoparallax.htm

...that you never addressed on this moon hoax thread.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3067&start=0
FatFreddy
 
Posts: 114
Joined: 12 Jan 2014, 03:31

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 06 Feb 2014, 07:36

FatFreddy wrote:I dealt with these issues in the fifteenth post from the top on this other thread.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3145

Ah yes, so you did. Here's what you said for clarity:
Q: What about the vast number of people involved in Apollo, wouldn’t someone have spoken out.

A: Pan’s claim there were half a million people involved in the Apollo program, but that includes all the humble engineers working on machine parts in many companies around the globe. So if someone is making a part in some engineering factory in Seattle, and his boss tells him it’s for the Apollo spacecraft, is that engineer proof the landings took place? No of course it is not proof, and even if that engineer knew they never made it to the Moon, he would still brag to his friends that he made a part that went to the Moon just to make him feel proud in some way or other. Parts for the Apollo program were made at many different factories around the globe. For example the laser reflector supposedly left on the Moon was manufactured in France. NASA collected the unit from the French company, and that was the last they saw of it. It’s probably stashed away in some archive at Langley, but one things for certain it’s not on the Moon. Are those French engineers proof they landed on the Moon? No of course not, as very few, (probably less than 200 people), were actually involved in bringing the whole lot together, so as to minimize what was actually taking place. No need for any of them to speak out because (A) They are 100% patriotic to the USA, and would say nothing that would go against America, even if it were true. (B) They do not need millions of dollars to safeguard their future, as they have already received substantial amounts from NASA just to “keep mum”. Read comments from people who worked on the Apollo program in the APOLLO FEEDBACK section.
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 06 Feb 2014, 07:38

FatFreddy wrote:I dealt with these issues in the fifteenth post from the top on this other thread.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3145


The anomalies in the pictures and footage are simply too clear. Here's another one...
http://www.aulis.com/stereoparallax.htm

...that you never addressed on this moon hoax thread.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3067&start=0

My wife will tell you, as will my employees, that I can only do one thing at a time. 91 things at a time kinda freaks me out. Hence, I would appreciate sticking to the topic. Thanks.
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 06 Feb 2014, 07:41

ProfWag wrote:
FatFreddy wrote: No of course not, as very few, (probably less than 200 people), were actually involved in bringing the whole lot together, so as to minimize what was actually taking place. No need for any of them to speak out because (A) They are 100% patriotic to the USA, and would say nothing that would go against America, even if it were true. (B) They do not need millions of dollars to safeguard their future, as they have already received substantial amounts from NASA just to “keep mum”. Read comments from people who worked on the Apollo program in the APOLLO FEEDBACK section.

Okay, so just to clarify, you agree with the person making the claim above that "probably less than 200 people" knew of the moon hoax?
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby SydneyPSIder » 06 Feb 2014, 07:48

ProfWag wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my hands around the thought of why people think the landings on the moon were faked in a studio.

Maybe because of this, at the very least????

http://www.aulis.com/stereoparallax.htm


Then there's all these problems with the photos:

http://www.aulis.com/jackstudies_index1.html

It will keep you very busy attempting to refute that lot one at a time.
SydneyPSIder
 
Posts: 1124
Joined: 10 Sep 2012, 18:24

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 06 Feb 2014, 09:11

SydneyPSIder wrote:
ProfWag wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my hands around the thought of why people think the landings on the moon were faked in a studio.

Maybe because of this, at the very least????

http://www.aulis.com/stereoparallax.htm


Then there's all these problems with the photos:

http://www.aulis.com/jackstudies_index1.html

It will keep you very busy attempting to refute that lot one at a time.


Syd, please note that I have respectfully asked to stick to one topic at a time. Your posts are for photographic evidence but this thread is on the question of how many people would have had to have been involved in the hoax. The current claim is that less than 200 total people were only needed to successfully perpetrate a moon landing hoax. If you have a thought on that, I would enjoy hearing it.
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 06 Feb 2014, 10:07

Okay, here is my initial list of people that would have had to have known we faked the moon landings. I came up with this list while watching Wheel of Fortune. Does anyone have other thoughts? Is this list a fair beginning?

2 Presidents
2 Vice Presidents
24 astronauts who circled the moon
100 Engineers (very, very low estimate) who designed all aspects of the Apollo program from the capsules, to the suits, to the training. Either all of these people knew the program was faked and didn’t have to work hard or they all thought it was real in which case, why not just send ‘em up if they knew it could be done. Right?
10 Mission Controllers (Estimate and that’s assuming they were all the same on every mission)
12 Administrators since the beginning of Apollo program (not including the acting Administrators) If the missions were faked in 1969, the current Apollo Administrator would have to know about it.
18 Deputy Administrators (They would also have to be involved)
15 Chief Engineers (Estimate) (They would also have first hand knowledge)
10 Photographic experts running the current Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (very low estimate as this would also include the students at Arizona State University)
10 (Estimate) who helped the astronauts sneak out of the capsules hide them for a few days, feed them, and then take them back up in a module that would be dropped from the sky. At least, that’s what Jarrah claims happened to Apollo 15.
10 (Estimate) that would have built the studio where the fake photos were taken
2 Photographers (low estimate)
2 Consultants (low estimate) on how to film slow motion
2 Engineers (low estimate) who would have expertise on how things would move on the moon.
1 Movie Producer
10 (Estimate) from the Manned Space Flight Network who tracked the vehicles all the way to the moon and back. (Goldstone, Madrid Deep Space Comm, Parks,, Honeysuckle Creek and Tidbinbilla. This is from Jarrah’s website and he claims they possibly did not know. If not, then several others from a communication network would have had to have set up the deception so I think 10 is a fair number.
5 Indian Scientists who verified we landed per their Chandrayann-1 Terrain Mapping Camera on 15 November 2008 (Very low estimate)
5 Japanese Scientists who verified the SELENE lunar probe obtained photos of the terrain that matched NASAs photographs (Very low estimate)
5 China’s Cheng’e 2 has evidence of hardware left on the moon (very low estimate)
2,000 scientists who have examined the moon rocks and verified they are from the moon (very low estimate)
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby pwil » 06 Feb 2014, 10:13

According to this site, it was much more than 200 people. Between the NASA staff, the sailors on the recovery ship, and the scientists studying the moon rocks is in the 1000'shttp://www.unmuseum.org/moonhoax.htm


Not to mention government officials and other NASA contractors such as IBM employees that helped with the onboard computers. And this is bare minimum. I know there must be many more than what I have listed.
pwil
 
Posts: 45
Joined: 22 Dec 2013, 00:10

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby pwil » 06 Feb 2014, 10:20

pwil
 
Posts: 45
Joined: 22 Dec 2013, 00:10

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby SydneyPSIder » 06 Feb 2014, 11:02

ProfWag wrote:Okay, here is my initial list of people that would have had to have known we faked the moon landings. I came up with this list while watching Wheel of Fortune. Does anyone have other thoughts? Is this list a fair beginning?

2 Presidents
2 Vice Presidents
24 astronauts who circled the moon
100 Engineers (very, very low estimate) who designed all aspects of the Apollo program from the capsules, to the suits, to the training. Either all of these people knew the program was faked and didn’t have to work hard or they all thought it was real in which case, why not just send ‘em up if they knew it could be done. Right?

Not necessarily all the engineers. They may have been making everything up to full spec in the belief the mission was a go.
10 Mission Controllers (Estimate and that’s assuming they were all the same on every mission)

Note they split the mission between Florida for launch control and Houston for mission control. This makes no sense practically. The space shuttle program had no such division of launch staff. One reason for it could be to minimise the number of people in the know for the faked missions.
12 Administrators since the beginning of Apollo program (not including the acting Administrators) If the missions were faked in 1969, the current Apollo Administrator would have to know about it.
18 Deputy Administrators (They would also have to be involved)
15 Chief Engineers (Estimate) (They would also have first hand knowledge)
10 Photographic experts running the current Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (very low estimate as this would also include the students at Arizona State University)
10 (Estimate) who helped the astronauts sneak out of the capsules hide them for a few days, feed them, and then take them back up in a module that would be dropped from the sky. At least, that’s what Jarrah claims happened to Apollo 15.

It's possible they stayed in low earth orbit for a few revolutions, ate all the food, and did an atmospheric re-entry, still quite risky and dangerous all in all, but nowhere near as risky and dangerous as landing successfully on the moon, dancing about and falling over in spacesuits with meteorites coming in at 20,000 mph, taking a lot of pics with film that would have melted and turned into toffee, keeping cool with just battery power, taking off successfully and re-uniting and docking with the command module completely successfully, and coming all the way back and splashing down within 1 km of the estimates, whereas the Russian landings could only be estimated to 700km -- 6 out of 6 times. And the only damage was to the fender of a moon rover! Some believe the Saturn V rockets were actually underpowered for achieving escape velocity.

10 (Estimate) that would have built the studio where the fake photos were taken
2 Photographers (low estimate)
2 Consultants (low estimate) on how to film slow motion
2 Engineers (low estimate) who would have expertise on how things would move on the moon.
1 Movie Producer

and camera people
10 (Estimate) from the Manned Space Flight Network who tracked the vehicles all the way to the moon and back. (Goldstone, Madrid Deep Space Comm, Parks,, Honeysuckle Creek and Tidbinbilla. This is from Jarrah’s website and he claims they possibly did not know. If not, then several others from a communication network would have had to have set up the deception so I think 10 is a fair number.
5 Indian Scientists who verified we landed per their Chandrayann-1 Terrain Mapping Camera on 15 November 2008 (Very low estimate)
5 Japanese Scientists who verified the SELENE lunar probe obtained photos of the terrain that matched NASAs photographs (Very low estimate)
5 China’s Cheng’e 2 has evidence of hardware left on the moon (very low estimate)
2,000 scientists who have examined the moon rocks and verified they are from the moon (very low estimate)

2,000 scientists? not true. NASA hands out sugar cube sized 'extracts' from the 'moon rocks'. They haven't verified they're from the moon, think about it, how is that really possible? They could have been picked up from the Antarctic ice via Wernher von Braun's otherwise completely unnecessary trip to the Antarctic, and many of the rocks match rocks commonly found in Western Australia. This has then hilariously spawned some ridiculous corollary geo theories that the moon must have been split off from the earth, etc etc. A regolith spectrographic assay made by the ESA some years later via an unmanned probe demonstrated a very different chemical composition.

Can we see the pics from:

5 Indian Scientists who verified we landed per their Chandrayann-1 Terrain Mapping Camera on 15 November 2008 (Very low estimate)
5 Japanese Scientists who verified the SELENE lunar probe obtained photos of the terrain that matched NASAs photographs (Very low estimate)
5 China’s Cheng’e 2 has evidence of hardware left on the moon (very low estimate)

please?

Otherwise, not a bad list, all in all. Amazing what military involvement, various spooks and a million dollar bribe to everyone involved can achieve! (Taken out of taxpayers' Apollo space program money. But hey, when you control the money printing presses and the credit system and abandon the gold standard in the early 70s, what's money really mean anyway?)
SydneyPSIder
 
Posts: 1124
Joined: 10 Sep 2012, 18:24

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby SydneyPSIder » 06 Feb 2014, 11:21

Then there is the psychology of a cover-up highlighted by Bart Sibrel over and over in his interviews with the 'astronauts', and by James Collier as per the youtube movie below. I find the attitude and psychology of the Washington space museum curator, 'Alan O'Dell' (sp?), very intriguing when Collier wants to measure some hatch sizes for feasibility from 17:50, at 38:30 and at 1:27:40, as well as the question he raises speaking to the tour guide ('Frank Hughes') about the correct colour of hypergolic fuel rocket exhaust etc. JW also points out in one of his videos just how much trouble Russian spacewalkers had getting back into hatches with inflated space suits -- hatches much larger than Apollo's.



Please note that youtube documentary is full of pictures of schematics, isometric views and images of the Saturn V rocket stack, moon rover and LEM for reference and so on. Interestingly many blueprints just 'can't be found' any more despite what you would think would be their huge intrinsic historical value for the US at the end of the project. There are no actual blueprints of the LEM or the rover any more, nor do the military subcontractors who made them have any copies. Very interesting. This documentary would raise doubts in any thinking person's mind.
SydneyPSIder
 
Posts: 1124
Joined: 10 Sep 2012, 18:24

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby FatFreddy » 06 Feb 2014, 21:11

Some believe the Saturn V rockets were actually underpowered for achieving escape velocity.


Take a look at this.
http://www.aulis.com/pdf%20folder/Pokrovsky1.pdf
FatFreddy
 
Posts: 114
Joined: 12 Jan 2014, 03:31

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby ProfWag » 07 Feb 2014, 07:13

SydneyPSIder wrote:Note they split the mission between Florida for launch control and Houston for mission control. This makes no sense practically. The space shuttle program had no such division of launch staff. One reason for it could be to minimise the number of people in the know for the faked missions.
...
It's possible they stayed in low earth orbit for a few revolutions, ate all the food, and did an atmospheric re-entry,

I'm leaving in a few minutes for Dallas (going to stop by the Texas School Book Depository--hopefully give an update while I'm there), but in any event, I have to make a couple comments.
First Syd, I wouldn't expect you to know this since you're not from America, but all launches begin at what's called the Launch Control Center (LCC) (usually Kennedy Space Center in Florida) and when the craft clears the tower, everything is turned over to the Mission Control Center (MCC) in Houston TX. Been that way since Johnson was President in the mid 60's as he was a big supporter of the space program. As such, they have "split" the missions from Apollo and for virtually every one of the Space Shuttle launches. Feel free to look it up.
Also, it is not possible at all that the rockets "stayed in low earth orbit for a few revolutions, ate all the food, and did an atmospheric re-entry." Too many people, amateurs to professionals would have been able to track a low earth orbit and no one could have found them all to pay them off...
Peach out all and I'll write in a day or two, hopefully from the 6th floor of Elm and Houston Streets!
User avatar
ProfWag
 
Posts: 3843
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 03:54

Re: Who Knew of the Moon Hoax?

Postby SydneyPSIder » 07 Feb 2014, 14:00

FatFreddy wrote:
Some believe the Saturn V rockets were actually underpowered for achieving escape velocity.


Take a look at this.
http://www.aulis.com/pdf%20folder/Pokrovsky1.pdf


hmmm,

A frame-by-frame examination of the motion picture film footage of the first stage separation of
the Apollo 11 Saturn V rocket was made. The velocity achieved at the separation point was
found to be significantly (800-1100m/s) lower than that required to satisfy the stated flight plan.
This finding implies that the declared payload needed for a return lunar mission could not have
been propelled to the Moon.

Thoughts on this paper, profwag?
SydneyPSIder
 
Posts: 1124
Joined: 10 Sep 2012, 18:24

Next

Return to Conspiracies / Cover Ups

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baidu [Spider] and 2 guests